The nutty Trump trolls, the Korea agreement and Democrat cold-warriors.

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Daniel Ellsberg. “I personally can’t imagine” says Ellsberg, “an agreement that would be worse — which would not be incomparably better — than a war with North Korea.”

Yesterday I posted about the results of the Korea summit  meeting between Kim Jung Un and Donald Trump in very positive terms.

My brother framed the results in broader global terms. You should check his post out. 

I am truly baffled by those who claim to be progressive or on the left bashing the meeting as if the threat of nuclear engagement that both Kim and Trump had been threatening for the past year was just so much rhetoric.

I don’t for a minute doubt that war was a growing possibility. I am not alone in this.

Daniel Ellsberg is quoted in The Intercept:

“I personally can’t imagine” says Ellsberg, “an agreement that would be worse — which would not be incomparably better — than a war with North Korea.”

Yet some liberals express outrage that Trump met with a dictator.

Or that he gave up joint military games with South Korea.

Or that Kim somehow out-played Trump.

They sound like old fifties cold-warriors.

Others on the left were more sophisticated. They saw the positive. There was an important discussion on Democracy Now!

JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Tim, I wanted to ask you about the statement that they signed, that the two leaders signed, that basically had four general points about committing to establishing new relationships between the United States and the Democratic People’s Republic of North Korea and building a stable and lasting peace. But one of the principles is reaffirming the April 27, 2018, Panmunjom Declaration, which is—really came out of the meeting of the South Korean leader and the North Korean leader back on April 28th. So this is really, basically, reaffirming what has already been negotiated, which is working toward an end to the Korean War.

TIM SHORROCK: That’s right. And I thought that was actually significant, because it does put the two Koreas back in the middle of this, of the middle of any agreement. And, of course, that Panmunjom Declaration did say, you know, ending the war, ending the hostility, and taking steps to end the hostilities, and then, of course, expanding it to make a peace treaty ending—formally ending the war, which would have to include China and the United States. Now, I was a little surprised that, you know, they didn’t actually say they were going to have a peace treaty or announce the end of the Korean War, as some people—as, actually, Trump had led people to anticipate. But I think it’s very important that this is included.

And In These Times published a good critique of MSNBC liberals like Rachel Madow.

Christine Ahn: Eighty-eight percent of South Koreans support the recent peace declaration between North and South Korea which says we’ve ended the Korean War and we’re starting a new era. I just came back from South Korea where women were saying, “Could you please tell the American people and international community that we want peace. Please could you pressure your government and silence the hardliners who are trying to derail this process for us?”

Isn’t that reason enough to support the peace process? We’ve allowed partisan politics to get in the way. Democrats don’t want to give a bone to Trump because it might impact the midterm elections. That’s just killing me.

But the irony is that in spite of this, the Trump trolls who never take the trouble to actually read what I post, insisted that I said just the opposite.

Of the dozens of pro-Trump anonymous comments I have received in the past day, most were like this one:

Fred and his nutty followers will surely find fault with Trump regardless of Trump’s efforts and possible peaceful outcome. They hate to see Trump succeed. Would rather not have peace than have Trump successful. THAT, is true hate!

 

15 thoughts on “The nutty Trump trolls, the Korea agreement and Democrat cold-warriors.

  1. Most folks I know are happy to see any brand of diplomacy over the alternative but they don’t think someone rates a Nobel Peace Prize for driving a school bus full of children to the edge of a cliff and then finally, at the last possible moment, hitting the brakes.

      1. They could change the name to the “Stop Me Before I Kill Again” Prize and award one post-humorously to Hitler for finally offing himself in the end.

        But now I’m just being cynical …

  2. I do believe in peace talks, & also watched Democracy Now last night. The experts expressed their opinions that the summit was positive. Good enough for me, I NOT being an expert. Although I do/will continue to ? news out of the WH (yet, again, 2 more communications people leaving–Sarah Huckabee Sanders & another), I also VERY much resent the whining & complaints of the S.O.S.O. DINOs. Really, Schumer & Pelosi, your rhetoric is tiresome on so many levels.
    & please, DLCC, stop pushing your corporate-hanger-on DINOs on us (e.g.,
    Villainraigosa {who LOST, despite MILLIONS spent on his campaign} & Cuomo).
    This is one time I’d like to see a Nixon (Cynthia, that is, for governor of NY) in office.

  3. Fred,
    I do some work with a gentleman that was a navy “top gun” pilot. He still has friend that work in a building we all know that has five sides.
    He was of the very strong opinion that after the “bottle rocket” demo last fall that the Trumpster was “this close” to taking rocket man out by whatever means necessary to get rid of the menace.
    Left, right or progressive that should scare us all.

  4. South Korea disillusioned after Trump-Kim summit

    One day after the historic summit between North Korean ruler Kim Jong Un and US President Donald Trump, there are a mix of reactions in South Korea.
    The initial results of local elections taking place on Wednesday with the inner-Korean rapprochement in the background showed positive outcomes for the governing Minjoo party.

    14 out of 17 mayoral posts and 10 of 12 parliamentary seats up for election went to Minjoo candidates. The results could considered be a vote of confidence for President Moon Jae-in’s North Korea policy.

    Nam Sung-wook from Korea University was quoted in the largest South Korean daily Chosun Ilbo as saying the “complete, verifiable and irreversible disarmament is no longer a question.”

    A major point of contention is Trump’s statement suspending US-South Korean military maneuvers, citing them as “expensive and provocative war games.” There are concerns that the longstanding military alliance between the US and South Korea could be weakened.

    Among South Korean conservatives, however, there is a growing feeling of disillusionment after Trump and Kim signed a letter of intent. For them, the potential denuclearization of North Korea now seems farther off than ever before.

    …Professor Park Won-gon from Handong Global University told DW that the letter of intent was “the biggest scam of the century that fulfilled 99 percent of North Korea’s wishes.”..
    Joseph Yun, a foremost Korea expert in Washington said “North Korea wanted exactly this, and I cannot believe that our side allowed this to happen. I am totally surprised that months of negotiations have led to so few results.”…

    http://p.dw.com/p/2zUZB?maca=en-EMail-sharing

  5. ALL of this is an attempt for Trump to get a Nobel Peace Prize. The man is just crazy for more adoration. He ramped things up with N Korea to make it look like they were going to nuke us and then he holds a summit to create a “peace” situation. This is just feeding into Trump’s enormous ego trip…..he’s like a 4 yr old in that he needs to get a prize for everything that he does.

  6. You must not have liked the article that I posted saying that S. Koreans have a mixed view of this ‘historic’ meeting. [The article disappeared.] Conservatives are against it because of no meaningful substance and the fact that the US and S. Korea depend upon a mutual alliance to protect S. Korea from military domination by the North. Many are hopeful and the ruling party will therefore stay in power.

    “Professor Park Won-gon from Handong Global University told DW that the letter of intent was “the biggest scam of the century that fulfilled 99 percent of North Korea’s wishes.”

    I agree with LisaM’s statement.

  7. WaPo: “To me, it was quite disappointing that we really did not put on paper any way that would test the seriousness of Kim Jong Un,” Joseph Yun, who until March served as the administration’s special representative for North Korea policy, told The Post. “We have to suspend our judgment” until something else happens, he said, but “there is nothing from the meeting to say we’ve achieved anything.”

    How the Trump-Kim meeting is polling: A new poll from Politico/Morning Consult found nearly half of voters believe Trump can handle the threats from North Korea, but significantly fewer believe he will be able to convince the nation to denuclearize. Just 18 percent of voters said it was “very” or “somewhat” likely North Korea will dismantle its nuclear program as a result of the leaders’ historic summit.

  8. Trump is saying that now he and Kim have a great relationship so now nobody has to worry about a nuclear attack by Kim. HIs adjectives uses to describe Kim are “very open,” “very honorable,” “very smart,” “very worthy” and “very talented” who “wants to do the right thing.” Trump must be totally ignorant of the fact that Kim has over 100,000 people in concentration camps and that rural people are starving to death. The large buildings in the capital city are only for show. There is nothing to purchase. I wouldn’t call someone who has his half brother and uncle killed because they were getting too close in power, “wants to do the right thing”. He has amassed the fourth largest military in the world. Even his soldiers are starving. One security guard that ran into S. Korea had a worm 11 inches long inside of him. That’s an example of how well he treats his ‘beloved people’.

    Trump told ABC’s George Stephanopoulos of Kim: “His country does love him. His people, you see the fervor.”

    Trump is proud as only an ignoramus can be proud. He is a documented liar.

    1. Carol. I think you have made the point you wanted to make. Kim is a bad man and you think Trump is wrong for talking to him. I’m not sure how we function in a world with nations and leaders, many bad ones, including our own bad ones, without them talking. But you should give your comments a rest for a while. Your points been made.

      1. Fred: Trump is RIGHT to talk with him. This is something that needed to happen. I am against the false flattery that he put on Kim and the fact that nothing concrete was written in the paper that both signed. Trump is playing to his base.

  9. I agree with Fred if he’s saying “give the devil his due.” Much as I disapprove of the trajectory of the pension dispute, I always credit the unions and their lawyers for how well they have protected the interests of their clients and constituents.
    So; it’s politics. Politics are partisan and partisans are single-minded and focused. Hating The Donald or Crooked Hillary, cleaning the swamp, “pension theft” or questioning peoples’ ethics or integrity — these are part of the expected rhetoric of politics. Even filing lawsuits or impeachment proceedings are (my belief) part of the political theatre. Certainly the Singapore Summit could have been political theatre also. But people (even newscasters and bloggers and trolls) should have some perspective if we are to restore the better parts of our political system … granting that the system is imperfect and unjust in some (or many) respects. The system was originally built on compromise among partisans continues to be its essential foundation. Revolution and disruption are always available alternatives, but “my way or nothing” seems to me a form of nihilism and Lenin and Stalin and Hitler (and some previous Popes) have sown a lot more human misery with their ideologies than would ever have resulted from the triumph of their utopian notions.

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